Summer in the Sierras: some questions from a lowlander.

[Skyeward]

Hey Folks,

I'm in the process of formulating a plan to head out to the Sierra Nevada this summer to do some backpacking. I'm probably going to John Muir Wilderness to help with some trail maintenence, and then a week long hike, which I still have no partner for, but something will probably pan out (hopefully go see some giant sequoias afterwards as well) That means camping at 10,000 ft+. I've always hiked in the East, so I don't know quite what to expect. Here's some questions:

how does acclimation work? should I give myself a day or two in the adjacent town before hiking in? Or do I just have to be careful and concious while hiking in? The trail head that trail work group starting at is at 7000, and climbs to 10,000 in the first few miles.

What weather should I expect? What day/night temps? How much wind? Precip?
This question is important as I'm not sure how much sleeping bag I'll need. I just got a WM Ultralite (1lb 10oz, 20*) to replace my WM Iroquois (1lb 8oz, 38*), which is only 2oz less but much less warm. I think the Iroquois is a better summer bag though: functions great as a quilt and is quite durable, and is just enough for summer temps here. But I don't know if it's warm enough for the high country. I can't really afford to keep both, it's a tough decision. What bags are folks using in the Sierras in summer?

Bugs? How bad are they?

Any other info or general comments about what it's like up in the Sierra Nevada would be great. Summer gear lists, memorable experiences, etc. I can't wait to go, but I want to be prepared!

Thanks a bunch

[Duckman_]

Your bag will be plenty. I used a WM Highlite(40* rating)in August and was super warm. Hell, I used the Ultralite in Co. above treeline in Spring which called for crampons or snowshoes the whole time. No probemo man.

Temps were from 100*+ down 5000' to prob high 30s up above 10,000' at night. "Normally". Bugs were bad below 6000'. Carry a headnet just in case, but....cover you head with a cap, shades, and bandana, and they all go away. Amazing. I used a white cap and white bandana(both the only cotton I carried, as the airs so dry, nylon caps and bandana dry TOO fast. I'd dip them both every chance I got along the trail...and thats not very often sometimes. Waters few and far between sometimes, and you dehydrate FAST out there) to make a Foriegn Legion looking cap, and was GLAD of it. The sun will bake your neck area. Yes indeedy. The sun out there it BRUTAL. Count on it. Need to be able to cover arms and such from the sun if need be, like a light colored longsleeve, etc. LOTS of sunblock. Places not expected like under the ears, underside of the nose, etc. The granite reflects the sun up not unlike snow.

Learn to hike early like say by 7:30-8:00am and if not at camp by say, 1pm...take a shady lunch, then hike later when the suns not so brutal.

We had 1 t-storm in 6 days. But that was THAT trip. Not much wind either.

The 1st or 2nd day in..you'll prob feel the alt the worst. We camped at the trailhead (5600')the first night cause we got there about 10pm. Think this helped tho.

I'm sure others will have much more to add. Hope some of this helps.

Duck

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[GreatDivide14]

As you hurl yourself up to 7000 feet in a day or so, you won't feel too good if you're doing any hard work. You have to push yourself a goodly bit to bring about AMS, but you'll be winded regardless. Two days at altitude should fend off severe AMS, but you won't have your normal strength for a few weeks, by my experience. As you've probably read, don't be macho about anything, least of all headaches. It might be a run-of-the-mill, hard-aerobic-workout headache, but don't take chances. AMS symptoms have been compared to drunkenness and hangovers, so just for diagnosis, go dry for a bit. This past summer, I drove out to Yellowstone (6000' or so) from 600', and a week after my arrival, I knocked off a 20-miler. No AMS symptoms, but I wasn't overpacking, and I didn't do so hot on the gentle slopes, and there weren't any steep ones. It took me about 10 hours. Two months later, I did Avalanche Peak (2000' up in 2 miles, then down again-- picture posted under "who are you?") in under 2 hours round-trip. I wasn't all that tired at the bottom. So, it'll be a while before you have your old strength back, but it will return.

This summer, I'll be living in Barstow, restoring illegal jeep trails in the Mojave when I'm not cruising around the Sierras on my 4-day weekends :) I'm fairly close to Giant Sequoia NM, Sequoia NP, Kings Canyon, Inyo NF, Sierra NF, Sequoia NF, Domeland Wilderness, South Sierra Wilderness, Golden Trout Wilderness, and whatever else is near Barstow on the SoCal page of your US atlas. I'm not an expert on the Sierras (yet), but if you're after a partner, I have my long weekends until June 18, then the job ends and I work full time as a tourist. Let me know if you'd like to work something out, or tell me to shut up.

[Skyeward]

Hey man,

thanks for the info. I sent you a private message about this summer.

[Skyeward]

I live at 2500ft most of the year and regularly hike above 5000. will this make any difference with acclimation?

[MN Josh]

I live at 2500ft most of the year and regularly hike above 5000. will this make any difference with acclimation?

Might help a bit but more than likely not. Altitude like you are describing is something else, one notch up from 5,000 ft. Where I grew up, it was about 5,500 feet and anyone visiting us from the flatlands was usually tired by 7 PM. When you go up to 10,000 the effect increases to include the symptoms of AMS, etc. I met up with EdK for a hike to 10,000 ft on Mt. San Gorgonio after staying with my parents for a week at 5,500. Still managed to get a splitting headache and feel dizzy and had to sleep it off all afternoon. One night at that altitude and it righted itself.

My advice is to stay well hydrated and well fed (I need stuff with salt in those conditions, you might vary), by using a hydration bladder and snacking constantly. One night at an altitude of 5,000-7,000 would better prepare you. Two nights and I think you'd be just fine, especially if you stepped up to 8,000-9,000 the second night.

Josh

[TommyG]

Hey Folks,

I'm in the process of formulating a plan to head out to the Sierra Nevada this summer to do some backpacking. I'm probably going to John Muir Wilderness to help with some trail maintenence, and then a week long hike, which I still have no partner for, but something will probably pan out (hopefully go see some giant sequoias afterwards as well) That means camping at 10,000 ft+. I've always hiked in the East, so I don't know quite what to expect. Here's some questions:

how does acclimation work? should I give myself a day or two in the adjacent town before hiking in? Or do I just have to be careful and concious while hiking in? The trail head that trail work group starting at is at 7000, and climbs to 10,000 in the first few miles.

What weather should I expect? What day/night temps? How much wind? Precip?
This question is important as I'm not sure how much sleeping bag I'll need. I just got a WM Ultralite (1lb 10oz, 20*) to replace my WM Iroquois (1lb 8oz, 38*), which is only 2oz less but much less warm. I think the Iroquois is a better summer bag though: functions great as a quilt and is quite durable, and is just enough for summer temps here. But I don't know if it's warm enough for the high country. I can't really afford to keep both, it's a tough decision. What bags are folks using in the Sierras in summer?

Bugs? How bad are they?

Any other info or general comments about what it's like up in the Sierra Nevada would be great. Summer gear lists, memorable experiences, etc. I can't wait to go, but I want to be prepared!

Thanks a bunch

Skyeward,

I don't think that you will have any problem with acclimating to the elevation - especially since you live at 2500' and regularly climb to 5000' You'll probably arrive in condition for that altitude since it takes several days for conditing to wear-off. I live in the SF bay area which is at sea-level and on trips to the Sierra's usually crash on top of Tioga Pass (10,000') or, if I can stay awake, in the rest-area on SR 395 (probably 7000'). Once, though, I got caught in a late-afternoon thunder storm about 200' shy of the summitt of Piute Pass and set up camp for the night. I experienced a very mild headache that night but that may have been due to the storm which sounded like WW3 at that altitude.

As far as bugs, unless you want to be eaten alive you will definitly need mosquito repellant! They are worse in mid to late season and will litteraly swarm you in some areas be totally non-existant in others. The latter is a RARE occurrance but they are territorial.

I usually hike the JMT/PCT in the early season (June) when there is a lot of snow on the high peaks and in the passes. The mosquitoes are not quite as bad then but it does get down into the 20's or lower at night. So, at the least, you will need 20-degree bag and possibly lower if you're not going to pack a tent. The Sierra is a ROCKY place and from my old army days I found that it takes about 30-days to become acclimated to sleeping on the ground; so I pack a thermo-rest air mattress to get a good nights' sleep. OK, a 3-season Sierra Designs Clip Flashlight CD tent too which packs small and weighs 4.8 lbs with fly.

Enjoy your trip to this fantastic place. I consider myself fortunate to live only a half-tank of gas away!

Thomas

[wingding0]

Bugs are bad in June and July, but by August and September they aren't much of a problem. The higher you get, the less bugs you'll find.

I tend to go in on the east side of the Sierra because it's easier access for me and I can get up higher faster.

It can get chilly at night, but by July a 30 degree bag should be fine because it rarely freezes in the summer. It can also rain for days or be dry for days. Often there are afternoon thundershowers. Unless you are at lower elevations, the tempertures are not typically higher than the 70's during the day. I don't like to hang around below 8,000 feet.

Yes, there is lots of exposure at the higher elevations so make sure you can cover up to avoid sunburn.

Maybe I'll see you out on the trail - I'm up in the Sierra quite a bit in the summer/fall. It's just so beautiful up high in the Sierra - alpine lakes, grand vistas, meadows with wildflowers, and plenty of solitude when you get away from the trailheads.












Skyeward,

I don't think that you will have any problem with acclimating to the elevation - especially since you live at 2500' and regularly climb to 5000' You'll probably arrive in condition for that altitude since it takes several days for conditing to wear-off. I live in the SF bay area which is at sea-level and on trips to the Sierra's usually crash on top of Tioga Pass (10,000') or, if I can stay awake, in the rest-area on SR 395 (probably 7000'). Once, though, I got caught in a late-afternoon thunder storm about 200' shy of the summitt of Piute Pass and set up camp for the night. I experienced a very mild headache that night but that may have been due to the storm which sounded like WW3 at that altitude.

As far as bugs, unless you want to be eaten alive you will definitly need mosquito repellant! They are worse in mid to late season and will litteraly swarm you in some areas be totally non-existant in others. The latter is a RARE occurrance but they are territorial.

I usually hike the JMT/PCT in the early season (June) when there is a lot of snow on the high peaks and in the passes. The mosquitoes are not quite as bad then but it does get down into the 20's or lower at night. So, at the least, you will need 20-degree bag and possibly lower if you're not going to pack a tent. The Sierra is a ROCKY place and from my old army days I found that it takes about 30-days to become acclimated to sleeping on the ground; so I pack a thermo-rest air mattress to get a good nights' sleep. OK, a 3-season Sierra Designs Clip Flashlight CD tent too which packs small and weighs 4.8 lbs with fly.

Enjoy your trip to this fantastic place. I consider myself fortunate to live only a half-tank of gas away!

Thomas

[NoKnees]

Tommy, that's a fun little hike. Did that one from sea level with a few friends for educational purposes.. At least that's how I look at it now. 5am wakeup call from the S.F. Bay Area to a 5pm camp just before the pass. Couldn't get anyone to hop over the pass with me the next day because they were so wasted from the altitude adjustment. Nothing major, just tired and hung over feeling. They had fun fishing the upper Piute lake at least.

Anyway, back to the subject... 20* bag will do fine that time of the year usually. At 10,000ft you can get into the 20's at night, especially if you are below some lingering snow in a low spot. Winds/exposure, hit and miss. Spring is usually pretty mellow, but anything can blow through anytime up at that elevation. My Dad has a great story from when he last hiked over Piute pass when leading explorer scouts. Basically they got caught in a 3 day storm that started rainy, and ended with 3 feet of snow at 11k. Not bad for a 4th of July weekend..

Anyway, expect good conditions, but be prepared for anything within reason... As always...

[Snow Nymph]

Bag: I use a 25 deg down bag (REI Sub-Kilo) for the summer. If I get cold, I can add layers.

Bugs: July is bad for bugs. I use bug pants and headnet, with a little Cutter unscented sprayed on the bug pants. Seems to work. For the ones that get me, I take a small amount of Preparation H. Apply to the bug bite right away (don't scratch it) and it shouldn't bother you.

Acclimatizing: Don't drink or take anything that slows the respiratory system. SnowDude has had HAPE 3 times and that's when he was going to the Sierra every weekend. Sometimes it hits and sometimes it doesn't. It usually hits him on the third morning. Now for longer trips, he sleeps at high altitude for a day or two before the trip. That seems to help. I know its recommended to sleep low and hike high, but this is what works for us. AMS gets me sometimes, depending on how much sleep I get, etc. I try to sleep higher that the trailhead (Cottonwood Lakes, Onion Valley or Rock Creek) since I drive up late, and come from sea level. I've gotten slight altitude sickness on trips where I slept lower than the trailhead, or not enough sleep.

Dehydration: Drink, drink, drink! I drink lots of Cytomax and have for years since my running days. I'm convinced that's what got me thru my first marathon. Don't let yourself get dehydrated. A camelback or platypus hydration system makes it easy to drink.

I'll be out every weekend. Post when you get here.

Too tired to think right now. Will add more when I'm more awake.

[Skyeward]

Hi everyone, thanks for the replies. Very helpful! I've thought of some more questions, as well as some additional info about my trip.

I plan to spend 1 to 2 weeks in the high country between 7/20 and 8/14. I'm no longer pinned down to a location, as I won't be doing the trail maintenance thing (found a hiking partner). So, as i know next to nothing about the area, what are some of the most spectacular places in the Sierra Nevada to backpack? Route info is welcome. I'll be coming from LA so stuff on the southern end would be closer, but I'll dirve further if it means better scenery.

can I rent a Bear canister when I get out there or do I need to buy one?

Water carrying: are there places where water is particularly scarce? Will I need to be carrying more than 2 liters at a time?

thanks again everyone, I can't wait to go!

[EdK]

Daniel....There are litterally hundreds of routes to choose from. From the south, Sequoia and Kings Canyon are easily accessable, as well as Yosemite. Yosemite might be just a little longer of a drive, but well worth it. In any event, it would be a good idea to have permit reservation in hand before arriving at the wilderness station or trailhead as the summer months get busy. A couple of years ago, myself and the gang from Ga. did the Rae Lakes Loop,(I had to abort after 3 days because of illness), but they completed it. I believe it's somewhere around a 50 mile loop with fantastic scenery at every turn. As for Yosemite, get a good topo and just sit down and figure a route out based on the mileage you want to put in. There's just no way you can go wrong with any decision. In October, we did the Tuolomne Meadows to Yosemite Valley hike, point to point,(there is a shuttle during the summer months), with a side trip up the backside of Half Dome...an experience of a lifetime!! My vote would be for Yosemite, with somewhere along the line hooking up with Half Dome, but like I said, anything you choose in Yos. is a winner. Bear cannisters are very available for rent just about everywhere in the Sierras as the bear population is very active during the summer months. Also....depending on where you go, ask if a parking permit is needed for your vehicle. Free of charge when you get you permit, but necessary in places like Yosemite. You won't have anything but a great time! Ed

[Snow Nymph]

My favorite place in the Sierra is Lakes Basin (http://community.webshots.com/album/33251789exwPvx). Nearest town is Bishop.

Route: South Lake/Bishop Pass, 8 passes (6 xctry), come out over Taboose Pass. This trip would require a car shuttle. Check out my website

Trip report is on the webpage (http://www.snow-nymph.com )
go to "Hiking and Backpacking"
then page 4 of the thumbnails
Click under the thumbnail of "Lakes Basin" for the trip report. (can't post link from website)

I've been on all but 2 east side trailheads. If you see something you like, I can give you more info. There's another trip "Sierrapalooza" from Jul '03, that we did in 5 days, on the west side. Another group took 7 days, but there are a lot of side trips that I would have liked to have done if I had the time.

Yosemite is cool, but I don't know about doing it in July. When we did the JMT in Aug '01, it was bumper to bumper traffic, and we weren't even driving. We left our vehicle in Mammoth at the Mammoth Mountain Inn and paid $15 for the YARTZ shuttle to drive us to Curry Village. Even that took 4 hrs.

Send an e-mail to snownymph @ socal.rr.com if you see anything interesting.

You can rent bear canisters at the ranger station when you pick up your permit. For a longer trip, I would recommend the Bearikade Expedition. I can get 10 days of food in mine, but I probably eat less than you guys.

Water: I carry only ~15-30 oz since there is water all over. Check the maps, and you can judge that way.

[Duckman_]

Ed! Your come-puk-tor is up again. Yaaaaa! Good to see you around again. Um...notice I've been yak'n again here? Heheh

My buddy Edster(on the left at King Canyon)...."eat moo chic-in" ..(the reason he got sick..long story)

..then Morris, Wayneo, and Barn.

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[EdK]

No mo' chicken fo' me!! Also....Wayne took a pic after this one was taken of you and me standing there....got that one?? This is what we planned for how many months before?? Finally, Duck and Edster, with the rest of the Ga. gang, hitting the trail. We'll do it again for sure. And yeah....my computer is back up, but boy, do I hate these things....@&#^%$%@&!!!!!! Ed